The graph you posted about patient volumes in New York Presbyterian Hospital supports what I said. And yes, my son and his wife were medical providers there.
There was a surge in March and April 2020 and then it disappeared and volumes went down to way below the baseline rate. And they treated doctors and nurses they knew Who were hospitalized with a severe Illness And my son also caught it In early March 2020 and had a severe infectious disease with temperatures over 102° Which appeared to respond to hydroxychloroquine I insisted he take
The article in late 2020 providing data on all the Northwell NY hospitals showed an 88% death rate in those ventilated with a diagnosis of Covid
DATA FROM ONE OR TWO PROVINCES IN CANADA FAIRLY EARLY IN THE PANDEMIC SHOW THAT 80% OF DEATHS ATTRIBUTED TO COVID OCCURRED IN NURSING HOME RESIDENTS
I appreciate the fact that you have provided evidence You are a serious person
However, there are those like myself who also look at evidence, and in addition have the experience of treating hundreds of patients who had a new disease and appeared to have similar syndromes which we never saw before
I too was sick 3 times with something I think was Covid though I never got tested because I considered the PCR test entirely unreliable
The upshot of what I am trying to convey is that there is a lot of evidence, much of it contradictory, and there is no reason for people to be shouting at each other When many of us have valid things to say, and they could probably be resolved We simply spoke to each other politely as you have done
Thank you for responding and for observing that I'm a serious person.
Respectfully, the graph does NOT support what you said, because you implied that high volumes were experienced in March and April 2020. ED visits were higher in January 2020 than at any point thereafter. Did your son and his wife report to you how busy they were in January?
Doctors and nurses they knew were "hospitalized with a severe illness"? Which severe illness? Which doctors and nurses? Are you suggesting nosocomial infections?
Your said your son caught "it" in early March 2020? What is "it"? He caught "it" "and had a severe infectious disease"? Which disease? Was he diagnosed? Was he hospitalized? He was sick for a period and then went to back to work at NYP?
Yes, I know the Northwell study very well and have written about it, but how does that fit with the COVID ICU intubated data, which show a peak census of 2,700? The excess NYC hospital inpatient death toll was ~15,000. Almost all of that increase attributed COVID-19 as underlying cause. Do you see how the census data don't allow us to blame 88% of hospital inpatient COVID deaths on ventilator use?
I'm not familiar with the Canadian data. Does that data say WHERE nursing home residents died? Can you explain what that has to do with the U.S. data? Can we agree that the U.S. should immediately disclose how many nursing home patients have die each week, regardless of cause or setting of death -- going back as far as such data exist?
You said you "treated hundreds of patients who had a new disease and appeared to have similar syndromes which we never saw before." What does "a new disease" mean"? When you say "appeared to have similar syndromes," are you expressing doubt/uncertainty? (I have no judgement about such doubt/uncertainty, by the way.)
When you say you were sick 3 times with something you think was "Covid," what do you mean? Why did you think it was "Covid" versus another illness? (FYI, I notice you typed Covid in this reply, but COVID in your original post. Can you explain this choice?)
Finally, I agree that there's no need for shouting. I did not take Dr. Yeadon to be shouting at Dr. Lawrie, did you? I notice you used all capital letters in your reply above when writing about Canada. Did you mean to shout or was that simply for emphasis?
It was your graph. it had highest patient volumes in April 2020 which is what my relatives saw. Why are you arguing with me about a graph you provided for inpatients at ny presbyterian? which I am simply reading from?
The PCR tests were unreliable and being unlicensed we could not obtain basic information about them such as the number of cycle thresholds, probes, primers and reagents used. Nor how they compared to the other 325 EUA PCR tests that FDA had authorized.
so we doctors used our hands our eyes and ears and dammit most patients responded to treatment very well.
Dr Nass, forgive me, but this is the graph I referred you to in my initial reply. It is inpatient admissions and ER visits at NYP Columbia from Jan 2019 through Dec 2020. https://substack.com/@woodhouse76/note/c-55256830 The 2020 peak for both was in January 2020. These data do not show an increase or high levels for either data point in March or April 2020. If you are looking at a different graph, please advise.
Regarding PCR testing, I'm not sure what question or issue you are addressing with your response. The tests were "unreliable" therefore...? What are the implications for the spring 2020 event, particularly in New York City -- which I believe is the focus of our exchange?
While I'm not offended that you're frustrated and swearing at me, it seems very much at odds with a desire to be civil and respectful.
I'm still not sure what patients were being treated for, or what the new disease was.
Same graph. According to it the ER volumes were highest them but inpatient was stable. Maybe that was because essentially all inpatient beds were filled before as well as during those bad 2 months? That is how it works in many urban hospitals in the US--in fact, the number of beds available in the US has decreased over the last 3 decades on purpose to keep hospital s at peak capacity as much as possible because the bean counters think life is more efficient and profitable that way.
Swearing at you? Get a life.
According to this story things were chaotic then. You have a graph issued by an organization called NY statewide planning and cooperative system (I never heard of them) which could be correct, and I have the information from 2 medical providers who were on the scene. Maybe both are correct? Why is it necessary for me to be wrong?
The graph is not issued by NY SPARCS. I created the graph from data published by that entity. Both the state of NYS health department and NYC DOH have told me daily hospital admissions data for hospitals aren't available via FOIA, so I've had to seek out those data where I can find it.
We do not know the inpatient census ("how many beds were filled") in this or any NYC hospital for earlier weeks/months because the state's facility dataset begins March 26, 2020 - the day after the CARES Act was passed. (Earlier data aren't available, per my correspondence with NYS.)
Like restaurants and hotels, hospitals need to operate at a certain capacity in order to pay the bills and make money. Regarding March/April 2020 in NYC specifically, the point is that available data are counter-narrative and counter-perception: hospitals were not overrun were patients.
"According to this story, things were chaotic then" - according to which story? Can you clarify?
You have what information from 2 medical providers on the scene?
I didn't say you were "wrong". I am presenting you with information that challenges your assertions. I would be happy to speak with your son and his wife about what they experienced. Colleagues and I interviewed an NYC doctor last year: https://www.woodhouse76.com/p/new-york-covid-19-hospital-frontline
I'm not sure why you're telling me to "get a life" when your original post was calling for mutual respect and a focus on the substance of argument vs. personal attacks.
You have to adjust for normal traffic in hospitals being at an all-time low because of people afraid to go to the hospital & many treatments/surgeries cancelled. Which means the bulk of the traffic was COVID only.
If you add normal hospital numbers ON TOP of what we saw the hospitals would be WAY over capacity.
So it's deceptive to only look at COVID only numbers. Look at ICU/Covid ward only not entire hospitals and all the departments that didn't see normal flow.
Thanks for standing up for truth against Jessica's made-up claims that COVID wasn't a novel pathogen that drove excess mortality.
Did you know that Jessica believes:
- COVID was not a novel virus & didn't cause increased mortality anywhere in the world.
- She questions whether viruses are real & whether you can infect another person via a virus.
- She claims there was a global conspiracy to fake a pandemic.
- She claims all-cause mortality was manipulated and faked
- She claims the Department of Defense may have brought human bodies into NYC to fake the numbers
- She claims strategic chemical poisoning by the government may have occurred in NYC instead of a virus that led to mortality
- She claims the CIA may have been involved in NYC to stage the fake pandemic
- She claims COVID isn't real but instead the "name of a covert operation involving death reclassification"
- She claims the US government sponsored mass murder/euthanasia in NYC hospitals in March of 2020
- She claims the flu shot delivery may have been part of the mass murder scheme by the government
- She believes a "localized point-release of an agent" may have occurred as directed by the government to kill people
- She believes the government "activated the equivalent of a bomb/chemical attack live-exercise simulation that staged sudden spread of a deadly agent" in NYC
She also blocks and censors most who challenge her and never offers substantive responses when debunked.
Dr Nass, It's admirable that you, your son and his wife were all on the Covid front lines! As I'm not very familiar with your substack nor your work overall, where were you treating patients in early 2020? How many patients overall versus COVID patients did you encounter as the health care systems were swept over? Maybe a percentage guesstimate?
I was a hospital doc until 2012 and treated outpatients in 2020. Because I was one of a handful of doctors in my state willing to prescribe HCQ, IVM, etc. I developed a practice that was 90% covid during peaks of covid activity in my state. In Maine the hospitals never went crazy with covid because patients with everything else stayed home.
Canadian data is clear. There was no pandemic. People have been dying at more or less the same rate every year. We had a bit of influenza related deaths increase in 2017-18 flu season at nursing homes and hospitals but not during so called pandemic.
How do you not know what "new disease" means considering Severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS‑CoV‑2) is a strain of coronavirus that causes COVID-19, the NOVEL respiratory illness responsible for the COVID-19 pandemic & main driver of excess mortality since 2020!
“ I too was sick 3 times with something I think was Covid though I never got tested because I considered the PCR test entirely unreliable.”
Why didn’t you test yourself for influenzas? You too bought into the propaganda that it completely vanished worldwide?
Didn’t your buddy Peter McCullough admit on Joe Rogan that the covid-19 kit CDC sent at the beginning of the pandemic couldn’t distinguish covid-19 from the flu? How did you know you had covid-19 3 times and not the flu even once?
No need to get on your high horse. I said I thought it was covid. When you don't have a reliable test you make clinical diagnoses. You try treatments and judge the response. Granted there is a lot of anger at doctors but I did my best, took detailed histories (no matter what the Board claimed, and always have for 42 years). Snarky commenters who have never treated a patient are unlikely to grasp the many clues we doctors use to make probably diagnoses during hard times.
A million different reasons cause people to Detox- just change the word disease to Detoxification Process. Everyone is exposed to different chemicals every day some got flu shots , many take Pharma, eat fake food, drink poison soda the list is endless. STRESS can make a person sick! FEAR of Death and a non existant virus can do it to. www.whatreallymakesyouill.com and www.VirusTruth.NET
Give me few reasons that can be proven by the scientific method with controls…
I hope you realize the magnitude of the problem to prove your theory?
I have heard the no virus supporters say that living next to 5G towers will give you covid-19 symptoms but that didn’t materialize because only a handful of people living next to the 5G tower go the symptoms. The same with stressed and not stressed people, eating well and not, drinking soda and not smoking and not…
You do realize that the 5g towers require such close proximity to each other that basically everyone is living next to 5g antennas at this point, right? They are not really towers. They are small cell site technology and they require another scs roughly every hundred meters or so.
The graph you posted about patient volumes in New York Presbyterian Hospital supports what I said. And yes, my son and his wife were medical providers there.
There was a surge in March and April 2020 and then it disappeared and volumes went down to way below the baseline rate. And they treated doctors and nurses they knew Who were hospitalized with a severe Illness And my son also caught it In early March 2020 and had a severe infectious disease with temperatures over 102° Which appeared to respond to hydroxychloroquine I insisted he take
The article in late 2020 providing data on all the Northwell NY hospitals showed an 88% death rate in those ventilated with a diagnosis of Covid
DATA FROM ONE OR TWO PROVINCES IN CANADA FAIRLY EARLY IN THE PANDEMIC SHOW THAT 80% OF DEATHS ATTRIBUTED TO COVID OCCURRED IN NURSING HOME RESIDENTS
I appreciate the fact that you have provided evidence You are a serious person
However, there are those like myself who also look at evidence, and in addition have the experience of treating hundreds of patients who had a new disease and appeared to have similar syndromes which we never saw before
I too was sick 3 times with something I think was Covid though I never got tested because I considered the PCR test entirely unreliable
The upshot of what I am trying to convey is that there is a lot of evidence, much of it contradictory, and there is no reason for people to be shouting at each other When many of us have valid things to say, and they could probably be resolved We simply spoke to each other politely as you have done
Thank you for responding and for observing that I'm a serious person.
Respectfully, the graph does NOT support what you said, because you implied that high volumes were experienced in March and April 2020. ED visits were higher in January 2020 than at any point thereafter. Did your son and his wife report to you how busy they were in January?
Doctors and nurses they knew were "hospitalized with a severe illness"? Which severe illness? Which doctors and nurses? Are you suggesting nosocomial infections?
Your said your son caught "it" in early March 2020? What is "it"? He caught "it" "and had a severe infectious disease"? Which disease? Was he diagnosed? Was he hospitalized? He was sick for a period and then went to back to work at NYP?
Yes, I know the Northwell study very well and have written about it, but how does that fit with the COVID ICU intubated data, which show a peak census of 2,700? The excess NYC hospital inpatient death toll was ~15,000. Almost all of that increase attributed COVID-19 as underlying cause. Do you see how the census data don't allow us to blame 88% of hospital inpatient COVID deaths on ventilator use?
I'm not familiar with the Canadian data. Does that data say WHERE nursing home residents died? Can you explain what that has to do with the U.S. data? Can we agree that the U.S. should immediately disclose how many nursing home patients have die each week, regardless of cause or setting of death -- going back as far as such data exist?
You said you "treated hundreds of patients who had a new disease and appeared to have similar syndromes which we never saw before." What does "a new disease" mean"? When you say "appeared to have similar syndromes," are you expressing doubt/uncertainty? (I have no judgement about such doubt/uncertainty, by the way.)
When you say you were sick 3 times with something you think was "Covid," what do you mean? Why did you think it was "Covid" versus another illness? (FYI, I notice you typed Covid in this reply, but COVID in your original post. Can you explain this choice?)
Finally, I agree that there's no need for shouting. I did not take Dr. Yeadon to be shouting at Dr. Lawrie, did you? I notice you used all capital letters in your reply above when writing about Canada. Did you mean to shout or was that simply for emphasis?
Again, thank you for replying.
It was your graph. it had highest patient volumes in April 2020 which is what my relatives saw. Why are you arguing with me about a graph you provided for inpatients at ny presbyterian? which I am simply reading from?
The PCR tests were unreliable and being unlicensed we could not obtain basic information about them such as the number of cycle thresholds, probes, primers and reagents used. Nor how they compared to the other 325 EUA PCR tests that FDA had authorized.
so we doctors used our hands our eyes and ears and dammit most patients responded to treatment very well.
Dr Nass, forgive me, but this is the graph I referred you to in my initial reply. It is inpatient admissions and ER visits at NYP Columbia from Jan 2019 through Dec 2020. https://substack.com/@woodhouse76/note/c-55256830 The 2020 peak for both was in January 2020. These data do not show an increase or high levels for either data point in March or April 2020. If you are looking at a different graph, please advise.
Regarding PCR testing, I'm not sure what question or issue you are addressing with your response. The tests were "unreliable" therefore...? What are the implications for the spring 2020 event, particularly in New York City -- which I believe is the focus of our exchange?
While I'm not offended that you're frustrated and swearing at me, it seems very much at odds with a desire to be civil and respectful.
I'm still not sure what patients were being treated for, or what the new disease was.
Thank you.
Same graph. According to it the ER volumes were highest them but inpatient was stable. Maybe that was because essentially all inpatient beds were filled before as well as during those bad 2 months? That is how it works in many urban hospitals in the US--in fact, the number of beds available in the US has decreased over the last 3 decades on purpose to keep hospital s at peak capacity as much as possible because the bean counters think life is more efficient and profitable that way.
Swearing at you? Get a life.
According to this story things were chaotic then. You have a graph issued by an organization called NY statewide planning and cooperative system (I never heard of them) which could be correct, and I have the information from 2 medical providers who were on the scene. Maybe both are correct? Why is it necessary for me to be wrong?
Thank you for continuing to engage.
The graph is not issued by NY SPARCS. I created the graph from data published by that entity. Both the state of NYS health department and NYC DOH have told me daily hospital admissions data for hospitals aren't available via FOIA, so I've had to seek out those data where I can find it.
Admissions were not steady - they dropped. I removed ED visits from the graph so that admissions are easier to see. https://substack.com/profile/32813354-jessica-hockett/note/c-55354691?utm_source=notes-share-action&r=jjay2
We do not know the inpatient census ("how many beds were filled") in this or any NYC hospital for earlier weeks/months because the state's facility dataset begins March 26, 2020 - the day after the CARES Act was passed. (Earlier data aren't available, per my correspondence with NYS.)
Like restaurants and hotels, hospitals need to operate at a certain capacity in order to pay the bills and make money. Regarding March/April 2020 in NYC specifically, the point is that available data are counter-narrative and counter-perception: hospitals were not overrun were patients.
"According to this story, things were chaotic then" - according to which story? Can you clarify?
You have what information from 2 medical providers on the scene?
I didn't say you were "wrong". I am presenting you with information that challenges your assertions. I would be happy to speak with your son and his wife about what they experienced. Colleagues and I interviewed an NYC doctor last year: https://www.woodhouse76.com/p/new-york-covid-19-hospital-frontline
I'm not sure why you're telling me to "get a life" when your original post was calling for mutual respect and a focus on the substance of argument vs. personal attacks.
You have to adjust for normal traffic in hospitals being at an all-time low because of people afraid to go to the hospital & many treatments/surgeries cancelled. Which means the bulk of the traffic was COVID only.
If you add normal hospital numbers ON TOP of what we saw the hospitals would be WAY over capacity.
So it's deceptive to only look at COVID only numbers. Look at ICU/Covid ward only not entire hospitals and all the departments that didn't see normal flow.
Hi Meryl!
Thanks for standing up for truth against Jessica's made-up claims that COVID wasn't a novel pathogen that drove excess mortality.
Did you know that Jessica believes:
- COVID was not a novel virus & didn't cause increased mortality anywhere in the world.
- She questions whether viruses are real & whether you can infect another person via a virus.
- She claims there was a global conspiracy to fake a pandemic.
- She claims all-cause mortality was manipulated and faked
- She claims the Department of Defense may have brought human bodies into NYC to fake the numbers
- She claims strategic chemical poisoning by the government may have occurred in NYC instead of a virus that led to mortality
- She claims the CIA may have been involved in NYC to stage the fake pandemic
- She claims COVID isn't real but instead the "name of a covert operation involving death reclassification"
- She claims the US government sponsored mass murder/euthanasia in NYC hospitals in March of 2020
- She claims the flu shot delivery may have been part of the mass murder scheme by the government
- She believes a "localized point-release of an agent" may have occurred as directed by the government to kill people
- She believes the government "activated the equivalent of a bomb/chemical attack live-exercise simulation that staged sudden spread of a deadly agent" in NYC
She also blocks and censors most who challenge her and never offers substantive responses when debunked.
Many of her claims debunked here:
https://sars2.net/nopandemic.html#Jessica_Hockett
Many of her cohort's claims debunked here:
https://sars2.net/nopandemic.html#Reasons_why_SARS2_was_a_novel_virus_and_not_in_widespread_circulation_before_2020
https://sars2.net/nopandemic.html#Other_people
Dr Nass, It's admirable that you, your son and his wife were all on the Covid front lines! As I'm not very familiar with your substack nor your work overall, where were you treating patients in early 2020? How many patients overall versus COVID patients did you encounter as the health care systems were swept over? Maybe a percentage guesstimate?
I was a hospital doc until 2012 and treated outpatients in 2020. Because I was one of a handful of doctors in my state willing to prescribe HCQ, IVM, etc. I developed a practice that was 90% covid during peaks of covid activity in my state. In Maine the hospitals never went crazy with covid because patients with everything else stayed home.
Canadian data is clear. There was no pandemic. People have been dying at more or less the same rate every year. We had a bit of influenza related deaths increase in 2017-18 flu season at nursing homes and hospitals but not during so called pandemic.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/443061/number-of-deaths-in-canada/
Great reply.👍🇦🇺
How do you not know what "new disease" means considering Severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS‑CoV‑2) is a strain of coronavirus that causes COVID-19, the NOVEL respiratory illness responsible for the COVID-19 pandemic & main driver of excess mortality since 2020!
Your claims about NYC hospitals have been refuted time and time again.
https://sars2.net/nopandemic.html#Low_number_of_occupied_beds_and_ER_visits_in_Elmhurst_Hospital_in_Queens
“ I too was sick 3 times with something I think was Covid though I never got tested because I considered the PCR test entirely unreliable.”
Why didn’t you test yourself for influenzas? You too bought into the propaganda that it completely vanished worldwide?
Didn’t your buddy Peter McCullough admit on Joe Rogan that the covid-19 kit CDC sent at the beginning of the pandemic couldn’t distinguish covid-19 from the flu? How did you know you had covid-19 3 times and not the flu even once?
No need to get on your high horse. I said I thought it was covid. When you don't have a reliable test you make clinical diagnoses. You try treatments and judge the response. Granted there is a lot of anger at doctors but I did my best, took detailed histories (no matter what the Board claimed, and always have for 42 years). Snarky commenters who have never treated a patient are unlikely to grasp the many clues we doctors use to make probably diagnoses during hard times.
If it wasn’t covid, what else could it have been?
Don’t get nasty Meryl. Why did you start this post? Is it perhaps because you would like some kind of closure? Peace?
If yes, to achieve this try not to avoid answering simple questions. Do you have too much pride or a big ego? If yes, I’d better do something else…
People want to know the truth and rightly so….
A million different reasons cause people to Detox- just change the word disease to Detoxification Process. Everyone is exposed to different chemicals every day some got flu shots , many take Pharma, eat fake food, drink poison soda the list is endless. STRESS can make a person sick! FEAR of Death and a non existant virus can do it to. www.whatreallymakesyouill.com and www.VirusTruth.NET
Give me few reasons that can be proven by the scientific method with controls…
I hope you realize the magnitude of the problem to prove your theory?
I have heard the no virus supporters say that living next to 5G towers will give you covid-19 symptoms but that didn’t materialize because only a handful of people living next to the 5G tower go the symptoms. The same with stressed and not stressed people, eating well and not, drinking soda and not smoking and not…
You do realize that the 5g towers require such close proximity to each other that basically everyone is living next to 5g antennas at this point, right? They are not really towers. They are small cell site technology and they require another scs roughly every hundred meters or so.
They are nothing like the 4g ones. They are not large, nor are they particularly noticable. They are millimeter frequency and they degrade quickly over distance . https://www.verizon.com/about/news/how-far-does-5g-reach